Skip to content
Main Street Plaza

A Community for Anyone Interested in Mormonism.

Main Street Plaza

A Community for Anyone Interested in Mormonism.

LDS Church becoming more and more Orwellian on gay issues

Alan, March 18, 2015March 18, 2015

The Presbyterian Church voted today to alter its stance on marriage:

Marriage involves a unique commitment between two people, traditionally a man and a woman, to love and support each other for the rest of their lives.

This is the kind of definition that attempts to blend the old with the new, kind of like how the LDS Church has taken steps to publicly support LGBT rights, but not marriage/same-sex intimacy.

The difference is that whereas the Presbyterian Church now actually welcomes gay couples into its fold, the LDS Church is maintaining a rather uncomfortable Orwellian situation where people are free to support same-sex marriage or coupledoms as “good” until they actually want to BE in one, when all of a sudden, it’s bad, sinful, etc.

There is also the Orwellian dilemma of Mormons having general permission from their leaders to support gay marriage, women’s ordination or whatever on social media so long as that support doesn’t appear like a strategic campaign to undermine the Church. According to Q12-member Christofferson, the Church functions by “persuasion, not coercion” (which is why one is free to hold opposing views), but he left unsaid that the shepherds are the ones to do the persuading, and the sheep must remain sheep or else risk coercion from the Church. I’m pretty sure that in a situation in which shepherds are trying to lead “from behind,” sheep will be punished who just happen to be out front and other sheep are following.

Obviously, the Church wants to be in a comfortable position when the US Supreme Court this summer overturns the remaining state bans on same-sex marriage. But I think things will become more and more uncomfortable/unstable for the Church.

While the Presbyterian Church can have a conversation and put it to a vote after which there are “winners” and “losers” (some of the losers leave, while others stay because, as one put it, “the conversation is important”), the LDS Church’s idea of a “conversation” is rather stilted (see the above persuasion/coercion doublespeak). Maintenance of the hierarchy means that any anti-gay things said by living apostles pretty much have to be upheld until, I don’t know, at least 10 years after they die. I’ve written before on how I’d hope someone like Dallin Oaks would take his decades of working on gay issues, reflect on the gaps/problems in his paradigm, and now work to alter his own position so as to not put the Church on a path of having to maintain his heterosexism.

But someone like Oaks is a reflection of a church with a heteropatriarchal theology that will be hard to work through for everyone involved. Another difference between the Presbyterian Church and why they can support gay marriage and the LDS Church can’t, is the former also ordains women so that ecclesiastical power is not tied to a single gender, thus not requiring compulsory heterosexuality to maintain it.

Homosexuality

Post navigation

Previous post
Next post

Related Posts

Turns Out that Utahns Aren’t Just Googling Porn

February 27, 2009January 31, 2025

DAMU members have long been suspecting that residents in the state of Utah were among the top consumers of pornography. There remained considerable uncertainty, however, because the only available data were Google trends. Now, Benjamin Edelman from Harvard University has confirmed conjecture with credit card data of pornography consumers. After…

Read More

the enemy of my enemy…

April 12, 2010

Is Fred Karger! Okay, that’s a little hyperbolic (I don’t consider LDS Inc. an “enemy”), but I’m certainly not a fan of the LDS Church’s efforts to disenfranchise a minority population in the U.S. Fred Karger, a covert Republican operative for years and now a Schwarzennager Republican, is leading the…

Read More

Mormon homophobia is so pass

October 25, 2010November 9, 2011

Even major corporations in Utah have seen the benefits of equality, like Intermountain Healthcare, which extended “domestic partner” benefits to same-sex couples last week. Props to IHC! Of course, what I mean by pass is that it is really only pass in corporate America to be homophobic. That same is…

Read More

Comments (2)

  1. visitor says:
    March 19, 2015 at 12:23 am

    The age-based demographic are clear and the disposition to marriage equality had been moving into older demographics steadily. Meanwhile, just as the civil dominoes began falling when MA legalized marriage equality, the ecclesiastical ones are also turning and will begin to pick up speed. The LDS isn’t by any means standing alone but the number of denominations standing with them and the fervor with which they dig in will wane over time. I have even seen evangelical churches looking for ways to backpedal recently in the US.

    I am also very confident that the new LDS landmark legal accommodation in UT will not stand a legal challenge when the right one presents itself. Equal protection is equal protection. Freedom and democracy are not conditional commodities.

  2. Alan says:
    March 19, 2015 at 12:54 am

    Pew research center has a handy chart on where various faiths stand on same-sex marriage. I’m not sure I agree about the dominoes, though, due to the gendered factor — the patriarchy part of heteropatriarchy. Some faiths, like Catholicism, Islam, and maybe Baptists and Orthodox Jews won’t budge for a long time, and while Mormon leaders won’t say as much, they probably do take cues from the Vatican.

    In terms of the religious liberties provision in Utah, well actually, I think it’s legally solid footing because religions have always been exempt from civil rights. From the Family Medical Leave Act, to the Civil Rights Act of 1964, to the Age Discrimination in Employment Act of 1967, and even the Americans with Disabilities Act. You’ll find a “religious exemption” in each one of those, although it is rather disgraceful how the Church cites this an example of carrying on the tradition of exemption. It becomes a question of public rather than legal pressure to change the culture.

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *

Mormon Alumni Association Books

Latest Comments:

  1. Anon on Collecting Nominations for the 2025 Brodie Awards!!December 12, 2025

    Most humorous episodes Britty the Apostate https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NRYqwEy6rhk Best new humorous/satirical channel: Britty the Apostate https://www.facebook.com/people/Britty-The-Apostate/61579368354784/ https://www.tiktok.com/@brittytheapostate https://www.youtube.com/@BrittyTheApostate

  2. chanson on Collecting Nominations for the 2025 Brodie Awards!!December 10, 2025

    Abstract Atheists for best new channel 2025.

  3. chanson on Collecting Nominations for the 2025 Brodie Awards!!December 10, 2025

    I've found two for a new category of personal survival stories (if we get one more, we can make this…

  4. chanson on Collecting Nominations for the 2025 Brodie Awards!!December 10, 2025

    For best history (or narrative nonfiction) book: The Juvenile Instructor Office: The Growth of Specialized Publishing in Utah in the…

  5. chanson on Collecting Nominations for the 2025 Brodie Awards!!December 10, 2025

    Thanks for the great nominations so far!!! I'm going to add some nominations here myself. I'll consolidate later. For Best…

8: The Mormon Proposition Acceptance of Gays Add new tag Affirmation angry exmormon awards Book Reviews BYU comments Conformity Dallin H. Oaks DAMU disaffected mormon underground Dustin Lance Black Ex-Mormon Exclusion policy Excommunicated exmormon faith Family feminism Gay Gay Love Gay Marriage Gay Relationships General Conference Happiness Homosexual Homosexuality LDS LGBT LGBTQ Link Bomb missionaries Modesty Mormon Mormon Alumni Association Mormonism motherhood peace politics Polygamy priesthood ban Sunstone temple

Awards

William Law X-Mormon of the Year:

  • 2024: Nemo the Mormon
  • 2023: Adam Steed
  • 2022: David Archuleta
  • 2021: Jeff T. Green
  • 2020: Jacinda Ardern
  • 2019: David Nielsen
  • 2018: Sam Young
  • 2017: Savannah
  • 2016: Jeremy Runnells
  • 2015: John Dehlin
  • 2014: Kate Kelly
  • 2013: J. Seth Anderson and Michael Ferguson
  • 2012: David Tweede
  • 2011: Joanna Brooks
  • 2010: Monica Bielanko
  • 2009: Walter Kirn

Other Cool Sites!

WasMormon.org
©2025 Main Street Plaza | WordPress Theme by SuperbThemes